The New York Spaghetti House...

[Wayne Boatwright]

...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and closed
sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its dishes, the
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty sauce
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown gravy.
Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its detractors.

I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed mushrooms
added to the sauce.

[Sqwertz]

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and closed
sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its dishes, the
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty sauce
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown gravy.
Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed mushrooms
added to the sauce.

Spaghetti, Cleveland, brown sauce.... Sounds like
Cincinatti-style chili over spaghetti (AKA: A "2-way").

-sw

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sat 03 Nov 2007 02:50:02p, Sqwertz meant to say...

Post by Sqwertz

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and
closed sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its
dishes, the most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a
very meaty sauce with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked
almost like brown gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm
sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.

Spaghetti, Cleveland, brown sauce.... Sounds like
Cincinatti-style chili over spaghetti (AKA: A "2-way").
-sw

Not in the slightest, Steve.

[Janet]

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and closed
sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its dishes, the
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty sauce
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown gravy.
Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed mushrooms
added to the sauce.
--
Wayne Boatwright

That sounds SO GOOD! I'm making a pseudo-bolognese right now because of the
Hearty Meat Sauce thread...I'd love to know what was in this one. Isn't Ohio
famous for its chili served over spaghetti (remembering Calvin Trillin)?

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sat 03 Nov 2007 03:17:48p, Janet meant to say...

Post by Janet

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and
closed sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its
dishes, the most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a
very meaty sauce with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked
almost like brown gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm
sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.
--
Wayne Boatwright

That sounds SO GOOD! I'm making a pseudo-bolognese right now because of
the Hearty Meat Sauce thread...I'd love to know what was in this one.
Isn't Ohio famous for its chili served over spaghetti (remembering
Calvin Trillin)?

Yes, unfortunately. It has to be one of the most vile things I've ever had
the displeasure to taste. That's Cincinnati Chili, home-based (naturally)
in Cincinnati. I guess many Cincinnatians and others from nearby regions
love the stuff. It recipe was developed originally by a Greek imigrant who
clearly new nothing about either chili or spaghetti. <G>

[FERRANTE]

I found this on the Internet:
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Del's Feast: New York Spaghetti House


Created: 8/25/2006 3:14:14 PM
Updated:8/25/2006 3:19:23 PM


We shared this week's Del's Folks Feast at the newly restored New York
Spaghetti House, a landmark downtown Cleveland restaurant since 1927.
History tells us a young New York man dedicated his talents to
building a Cleveland restaurant New York style.

Through the years the menu has been updated, however, spaghetti is
still the most popular dish, topped with a special brown sauce.

The restaurant is open for lunch and dinner every day.

Plus check out THEIR website!
http://www.newyorkspaghettihouse.com/faqs.html
Go to products and you can see where to buy their brown sauce!

Here is a fan's tribute site to that place. Must have been popular
with a lot of people!
http://members.tripod.com/~Gardens/NYSpag.html

Mark
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sat 03 Nov 2007 03:20:18p, FERRANTE meant to say...

Post by FERRANTE
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
--- Del's Feast: New York Spaghetti House
Created: 8/25/2006 3:14:14 PM
Updated:8/25/2006 3:19:23 PM
We shared this week's Del's Folks Feast at the newly restored New York
Spaghetti House, a landmark downtown Cleveland restaurant since 1927.
History tells us a young New York man dedicated his talents to
building a Cleveland restaurant New York style.
Through the years the menu has been updated, however, spaghetti is
still the most popular dish, topped with a special brown sauce.
The restaurant is open for lunch and dinner every day.
Plus check out THEIR website!
http://www.newyorkspaghettihouse.com/faqs.html
Go to products and you can see where to buy their brown sauce!
Here is a fan's tribute site to that place. Must have been popular
with a lot of people!
http://members.tripod.com/~Gardens/NYSpag.html
Mark
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Mark, thank you for your efforts, but unfortunately, I've been down that
road before. The product you can buy now bears little resemblance to what
was served in the restaurant. There are tons of references to the
restaurant on the Internet, and I've looked at many of them.

Members of the family tried to open another restaurant in nearby Westlake,
Ohio but even the food there did not seem the same, and it failed after
about a year.

Some friends still in Cleveland bought the frozen sauce (both the Brown
Sauce and their Romano Sauce), and declared them edible but not what they
were.

Thanks again...

:-(((

[Giusi]

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and closed
sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its dishes, the
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty sauce
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown gravy.
Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed mushrooms
added to the sauce.
--
Wayne Boatwright

Artusi's meat sauce in his seminal Italian cook book is like that. It's
meat plus seasonings cooking in milk, and it is optional as to whether to
add tomato concentrate at all, and if added it is only a tablespoon or so.

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 06:27:52a, Giusi meant to say...

Post by Giusi

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and closed
sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its dishes, the
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty sauce
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown
gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its
detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.
--
Wayne Boatwright

Artusi's meat sauce in his seminal Italian cook book is like that. It's
meat plus seasonings cooking in milk, and it is optional as to whether to
add tomato concentrate at all, and if added it is only a tablespoon or so.

Could you posssibly post that? I would really love to try it.

TIA

[Giusi]

"Wayne Boatwright" <***@cox.net> ha scritto nel messaggio news:***@69.28.173.184...
It was famous for several of its dishes,

Post by Wayne Boatwright
the

Post by Giusi

Post by Wayne Boatwright
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty

sauce

Post by Giusi

Post by Wayne Boatwright
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown
gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its
detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.
--
Wayne Boatwright

Artusi's meat sauce in his seminal Italian cook book is like that. It's
meat plus seasonings cooking in milk, and it is optional as to whether to
add tomato concentrate at all, and if added it is only a tablespoon or

so.
Could you posssibly post that? I would really love to try it.
TIA
--
Wayne Boatwright

While this book is a great read, the indexing is sparse. I haven't found
the one with milk that I've often made. Maybe it's from a different book?
Here, however, is Artusi's Bolognese meat sauce just as he wrote it, but
translated. It serves three. My ideas have ** around them.

about 5.25 ounces of veal diced very small
1.66 ounces of bacon (pamcetta dolce)
1.33 ounces butter
1/4 of a medium onion
1/2 of a carrot
2 palm sized lengths of celery
a small pinch of flour
a small pot of broth
very little or no salt, because the bacon and the broth have salt
pepper and optionally a scrape or two of nutmeg

Mince the bacon and the herbs very finely (with a mezzaluna) Put all the
main ingredients on the fire with the butter. When the meat has browned,
add the pinch of flour and then cook in broth until it is done.

**The "maccheroni" he calls for is called horse's teeth and you'd have to
make that. He uses about a pound. They use much less sauce here than in
America.**

Drain the macaroni well; flavor with Parmigiano Reggiano and this sauce.
The sauce can be made even tastier adding small pieces of dried mushrooms, a
few truffle slices, or a chicken liver cut small and cooked with the meats.
When everything is done and combined, you can add as a final touch a half
glass of cream (that usually means 1.75 ounces here.) Remember, in any
case, that the macaroni must not be served too dry, but rather well-coated
in sauce

**This is a go-to book if you want to know what Italian dishes were
originally like, since it dates from the 1870s. It's main value is in the
history and regional remarks, as all the recipes are written for cooking in
a fireplace.

The ragù recipe I make most often is done very similarly, except the broth
is replaced with milk, and as it cooks and reduces it gets quite brown. You
stir a little tomato concentrate in towards the end, and then IMO not
optionally, grate nutmeg over it to your taste. I use coarse chopped meat
for it, and as I recall, there was also the suggestion of melting butter
into at the very end, which I sometimes do. i'quite rich and makes a very
good filling for manicotti or crepes.**

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 10:34:26a, Giusi meant to say...

Post by Wayne Boatwright
It was famous for several of its dishes,

Post by Wayne Boatwright
the

Post by Giusi

Post by Wayne Boatwright
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty
sauce with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like
brown gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it
had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.
--
Wayne Boatwright

Artusi's meat sauce in his seminal Italian cook book is like that.
It's meat plus seasonings cooking in milk, and it is optional as to
whether to add tomato concentrate at all, and if added it is only a
tablespoon or so.

Could you posssibly post that? I would really love to try it.
TIA
--
Wayne Boatwright

While this book is a great read, the indexing is sparse. I haven't
found the one with milk that I've often made. Maybe it's from a
different book? Here, however, is Artusi's Bolognese meat sauce just as
he wrote it, but translated. It serves three. My ideas have ** around
them.
about 5.25 ounces of veal diced very small
1.66 ounces of bacon (pamcetta dolce)
1.33 ounces butter
1/4 of a medium onion
1/2 of a carrot
2 palm sized lengths of celery
a small pinch of flour
a small pot of broth
very little or no salt, because the bacon and the broth have salt
pepper and optionally a scrape or two of nutmeg
Mince the bacon and the herbs very finely (with a mezzaluna) Put all
the main ingredients on the fire with the butter. When the meat has
browned, add the pinch of flour and then cook in broth until it is done.
**The "maccheroni" he calls for is called horse's teeth and you'd have
to make that. He uses about a pound. They use much less sauce here
than in America.**
Drain the macaroni well; flavor with Parmigiano Reggiano and this sauce.
The sauce can be made even tastier adding small pieces of dried
mushrooms, a few truffle slices, or a chicken liver cut small and cooked
with the meats. When everything is done and combined, you can add as a
final touch a half glass of cream (that usually means 1.75 ounces here.)
Remember, in any case, that the macaroni must not be served too dry,
but rather well-coated in sauce
**This is a go-to book if you want to know what Italian dishes were
originally like, since it dates from the 1870s. It's main value is in
the history and regional remarks, as all the recipes are written for
cooking in a fireplace.
The ragù recipe I make most often is done very similarly, except the
broth is replaced with milk, and as it cooks and reduces it gets quite
brown. You stir a little tomato concentrate in towards the end, and
then IMO not optionally, grate nutmeg over it to your taste. I use
coarse chopped meat for it, and as I recall, there was also the
suggestion of melting butter into at the very end, which I sometimes do.
i'quite rich and makes a very good filling for manicotti or crepes.**

Thank you so very much for posting this for me. I've added it to my recipe
file and will try it soon. It's particularly intriguing to know it has
such a history!

[MareCat]

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and closed
sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its dishes, the
most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a very meaty sauce
with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked almost like brown gravy.
Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed mushrooms
added to the sauce.

It sounds delicious, Wayne. What did you do (specifically) during your
attempts to replicate the sauce?

You've probably read this before, but I found this in the NYSH FAQs (to give
you more info about how the sauce is made at the restaurant):

Q: If the Brown Sauce is a meat sauce, where's the meat?
A: A large quantity of meat is contained in this sauce. In staying with the
traditional texture, it is ground to nearly a pureed consistency. In the
early days, and until very recent time, meat at the New York Spaghetti House
was purchased in whole pieces and cut into servings by the head chef. Then,
the extra pieces of the leg of lamb, the fillet of beef, the leg of veal,
and the pork that were not suitable for a required portion on an entrée were
ground together finely and went into making the brown sauce. Today, only
high quality beef and pork are used and, staying true to the original
recipe, it too is ground very fine into a pureed consistency after it has
been cooked with the some spices, onion, garlic and a small dash of red wine
vinegar.



Mary

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 08:11:37a, MareCat meant to say...

Post by MareCat

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and
closed sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its
dishes, the most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a
very meaty sauce with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked
almost like brown gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm
sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.

It sounds delicious, Wayne. What did you do (specifically) during your
attempts to replicate the sauce?
You've probably read this before, but I found this in the NYSH FAQs (to
Q: If the Brown Sauce is a meat sauce, where's the meat?
A: A large quantity of meat is contained in this sauce. In staying with
the traditional texture, it is ground to nearly a pureed consistency. In
the early days, and until very recent time, meat at the New York
Spaghetti House was purchased in whole pieces and cut into servings by
the head chef. Then, the extra pieces of the leg of lamb, the fillet of
beef, the leg of veal, and the pork that were not suitable for a
required portion on an entrée were ground together finely and went into
making the brown sauce. Today, only high quality beef and pork are used
and, staying true to the original recipe, it too is ground very fine
into a pureed consistency after it has been cooked with the some spices,
onion, garlic and a small dash of red wine vinegar.
Mary

Thanks, Mary...

Well, the first time I tried making it was a few months after the
restaurant closed and there was no websigt or FAQ. I used ground beef,
ground veal, and ground pork, and an approach much like a bolognese sauce.
No tomatoes, but I did saute onion, garlic, carrot, and celery. I used
small amounts or oregano and basil, but I didn't know about the vinegar. I
believe I also added a small amount of red wine, and some beef stock.
The result was tasty, but definitely not "the sauce". The meat was still
too coarse and the flavor was wrong.

I didn't try it again until after the website and the FAQ. Sooo, I began
by using whole pieces of meat (the same combination), cutting it in
smallish pieces before cooking in beef stock. I repeated the same
assortment of vegetables, sauteed and added to the cooking meat. I put the
whole thing through the find plate of the meat grinder twice. I did add a
bit of red wine vinegar and did not add the wine. This attempt was much
better, but still not quite right.

I've tried it two more times since then, with basically the same approach,
but varying the balance of ingredients and spices, and putting it through
the meat grinder 3 and 4 times. I end up with a good sauce, but it still
doesn't measure up to what the restaurant made. I suppose it may be the
balance of ingredients. I do get the right consistency, and if I had never
tasted the restaurant's sauce, I would probably be very please with the
result.

I guess I just have to keep practicing. Or, just maybe, it was eating it at
the New York Spaghetti House that was the charm. :-)

Their frozen product available for purchase in the Cleveland area isn't as
good as mine.

[MareCat]

Post by Wayne Boatwright
Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 08:11:37a, MareCat meant to say...

Post by MareCat

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and
closed sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its
dishes, the most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a
very meaty sauce with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked
almost like brown gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although I'm
sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.

It sounds delicious, Wayne. What did you do (specifically) during your
attempts to replicate the sauce?
You've probably read this before, but I found this in the NYSH FAQs (to
Q: If the Brown Sauce is a meat sauce, where's the meat?
A: A large quantity of meat is contained in this sauce. In staying with
the traditional texture, it is ground to nearly a pureed consistency. In
the early days, and until very recent time, meat at the New York
Spaghetti House was purchased in whole pieces and cut into servings by
the head chef. Then, the extra pieces of the leg of lamb, the fillet of
beef, the leg of veal, and the pork that were not suitable for a
required portion on an entrée were ground together finely and went into
making the brown sauce. Today, only high quality beef and pork are used
and, staying true to the original recipe, it too is ground very fine
into a pureed consistency after it has been cooked with the some spices,
onion, garlic and a small dash of red wine vinegar.
Mary

Thanks, Mary...
Well, the first time I tried making it was a few months after the
restaurant closed and there was no websigt or FAQ. I used ground beef,
ground veal, and ground pork, and an approach much like a bolognese sauce.
No tomatoes, but I did saute onion, garlic, carrot, and celery. I used
small amounts or oregano and basil, but I didn't know about the vinegar.
I
believe I also added a small amount of red wine, and some beef stock.
The result was tasty, but definitely not "the sauce". The meat was still
too coarse and the flavor was wrong.
I didn't try it again until after the website and the FAQ. Sooo, I began
by using whole pieces of meat (the same combination), cutting it in
smallish pieces before cooking in beef stock. I repeated the same
assortment of vegetables, sauteed and added to the cooking meat. I put the
whole thing through the find plate of the meat grinder twice. I did add a
bit of red wine vinegar and did not add the wine. This attempt was much
better, but still not quite right.
I've tried it two more times since then, with basically the same approach,
but varying the balance of ingredients and spices, and putting it through
the meat grinder 3 and 4 times. I end up with a good sauce, but it still
doesn't measure up to what the restaurant made. I suppose it may be the
balance of ingredients. I do get the right consistency, and if I had never
tasted the restaurant's sauce, I would probably be very please with the
result.

OK, you're making me hungry, Wayne! LOL. Even your "failed" attempts sound
really good. I'm going to try making something like your second attempt soon
(this week looks pretty booked up as far as planned meals go, but maybe next
week). Thanks.

Mary

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 01:21:21p, MareCat meant to say...

Post by MareCat

Post by Wayne Boatwright
Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 08:11:37a, MareCat meant to say...

Post by MareCat

Post by Wayne Boatwright
...was a family run restaurant in Cleveland that opened in 1927 and
closed sometime in the late 1990s. It was famous for several of its
dishes, the most notable probably being its "Brown Sauce". It was a
very meaty sauce with a robust hearty flavor and a color that looked
almost like brown gravy. Most people who ate it loved it, although
I'm sure it had its detractors.
I've never been able to find a recipe or succeed in many attempts at
duplicating the sauce. Many people ordered it with fresh sauteed
mushrooms added to the sauce.

It sounds delicious, Wayne. What did you do (specifically) during your
attempts to replicate the sauce?
You've probably read this before, but I found this in the NYSH FAQs
Q: If the Brown Sauce is a meat sauce, where's the meat?
A: A large quantity of meat is contained in this sauce. In staying
with the traditional texture, it is ground to nearly a pureed
consistency. In the early days, and until very recent time, meat at
the New York Spaghetti House was purchased in whole pieces and cut
into servings by the head chef. Then, the extra pieces of the leg of
lamb, the fillet of beef, the leg of veal, and the pork that were not
suitable for a required portion on an entrée were ground together
finely and went into making the brown sauce. Today, only high quality
beef and pork are used and, staying true to the original recipe, it
too is ground very fine into a pureed consistency after it has been
cooked with the some spices, onion, garlic and a small dash of red
wine vinegar.
Mary

Thanks, Mary...
Well, the first time I tried making it was a few months after the
restaurant closed and there was no websigt or FAQ. I used ground beef,
ground veal, and ground pork, and an approach much like a bolognese
sauce. No tomatoes, but I did saute onion, garlic, carrot, and celery.
I used small amounts or oregano and basil, but I didn't know about the
vinegar. I
believe I also added a small amount of red wine, and some beef stock.
The result was tasty, but definitely not "the sauce". The meat was
still too coarse and the flavor was wrong.
I didn't try it again until after the website and the FAQ. Sooo, I
began by using whole pieces of meat (the same combination), cutting it
in smallish pieces before cooking in beef stock. I repeated the same
assortment of vegetables, sauteed and added to the cooking meat. I put
the whole thing through the find plate of the meat grinder twice. I
did add a bit of red wine vinegar and did not add the wine. This
attempt was much better, but still not quite right.
I've tried it two more times since then, with basically the same
approach, but varying the balance of ingredients and spices, and
putting it through the meat grinder 3 and 4 times. I end up with a
good sauce, but it still doesn't measure up to what the restaurant
made. I suppose it may be the balance of ingredients. I do get the
right consistency, and if I had never tasted the restaurant's sauce, I
would probably be very please with the result.

OK, you're making me hungry, Wayne! LOL. Even your "failed" attempts
sound really good. I'm going to try making something like your second
attempt soon (this week looks pretty booked up as far as planned meals
go, but maybe next week). Thanks.
Mary

Oh, good, give it a go when you have a chance, and let me know what you
think of it!

[Hacienda de Ville]

On Sun, 04 Nov 2007 17:04:44 GMT, Wayne Boatwright

Post by Wayne Boatwright
I guess I just have to keep practicing. Or, just maybe, it was eating it at
the New York Spaghetti House that was the charm. :-)

Dearest Wayne,
You're probably right with the above. Unfortunately, what once was
can never be again. And maybe it shouldn't. Those are fond memories
you have and even if you were able to duplicate the sauce, you might
find that it just doesn't seem the same.
It's like my first love, David. We were both in 7th grade and
school let out for lunch from 11:30a.m. to 1:00p.m. I would run home,
eat, and then run to David's house since his parents were at work. We
then ate each other until time to get back to school. That went on
almost everyday during 7th and 8th grades. Since those days, long ago,
I have been with several hundred, if not thousand(s) of guys, yet none
ever could come close to serving up the meat David fed me. It was a
special time in our lives. He went on to get married and I went on and
continued to enjoy my thing. I saw him recently and I felt nothing for
him. I guess that is the way life is, sadly...
One last thing. We (David and I) are both Italian, black wavy hair,
dark eyes, slim, all of that, so like you in Cleveland so many years
ago, I also was eating "pasta" only the noodle was bigger than any
cannoli I've ever placed in my mouth.
Hang on to your memories. When your alone, as I am, it's all you
have.

Mark Anthony Ferrante

[Wayne Boatwright]

Oh pshaw, on Sun 04 Nov 2007 05:06:10p, Hacienda de Ville meant to say...

Post by Hacienda de Ville
Dearest Wayne,
You're probably right with the above. Unfortunately, what once was
can never be again. And maybe it shouldn't. Those are fond memories
you have and even if you were able to duplicate the sauce, you might
find that it just doesn't seem the same.

Dear Mark,

You are so right about that. Sometimes the present reality is nothing at
all like the fond memories you hold close to you. I may never find that
perfect sauce, but I will never forget what it was like.

I have responded privately to you in e-mail as well, assuming that your
header is correct. If it is not, please forward it on and I will re-send
what I wrote.

Cheers!
Wayne

[Hacienda de Ville]

Dearest Wayne,
I just checked and yes, it is there. I am on the run and will read
it later and respond.
Thanks so much for responding to me.

Mark